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Thread: Grammar & Latin curriculums?

  1. #11
    Dear Tammy and Laurie,

    Tammy, I’ll address each of your points in order. If you finish three volumes of Latin Road to English Grammar or Latin in the Christian Trivium, you will end up about the same place. Neither program requires DVDs. Christian Trivium offers a very affordable on-line class.($135 per semester.) The class won’t make learning Latin easy but it does help us greatly by providing weekly accountability keeps us on schedule and provides teachers who (unlike mom) are experienced Latin teachers and enthusiasts. At your daughter’s age, she should be able to complete the three levels in less than three years. If she’s like my own kids, she’d be more likely to move through the program quickly with the accountability of an on-line class. Both programs offer to help with questions via e-mail. Of the two, only LC Trivium offers a fourth year. I’m guessing those who use LREG could easily transfer to 4th year LCTrivium if they wanted to.

    I purchased the DVDs for LREG and was very disappointed. I anticipated they would be directed towards the student. This was not the author’s fault. I didn’t read the web-site carefully enough. I assumed it would be like our Logic DVDs and others we have used in which the teacher speaks directly to the student. The author’s intention in producing the LREG DVDs was to teach mom how to teach the kids. Now other curriculums we’ve used, IEW and Math-U-See come to mind, were taped for the moms too, but my kids have enjoyed watching them with me so we’ve learned together. Not so with the LREG DVDs. The kiddos wouldn’t look at them! I was frustrated. But again, that was my fault.

    Both courses will have a lot of grammar. It looks to me like both begin the first year geared toward the dialect level student begin (ideally started in 6th or 7th grade) and progress as the months go by into rhetoric. I sold LREG so I’m relying on my memory and their web-site. The LREG web-site says three years of their program counts as two years of foreign language and they add, “…some schools and home school programs have also given English grammar credit to those who have completed Volume III”. The Latin in the Christian Trivium web-site says, “Three volumes are accredited by the University of California as THREE years' High School Latin credit, containing all the necessary grammatical constructions.”

    One thing that hasn’t been mentioned in our discussion is cost. I was trying to compare but LREG doesn’t have their prices itemized. I checked out Sonlight’s web-site since they have a similar package to LCTrivium. If someone purchases from the LREG web-site (as I did) it appears they’d spend more than on the Sonlight site. LREG provides a spiffy notebook which I liked whereas LCTrivium doesn’t. Other than that, if we get to the end of the three years with essentially the same Latin knowledge, the difference in cost is significant. At the very least, three years of LREG is $573.90 and LCTrivium is $347.65. I got out my calculator and added this three times since I can’t quite believe it. Please anyone; correct me if I’ve made a mistake.
    And to Laurie, I wasn’t intending to say that LRTEG isn’t Christian. At the moment I was typing, in my menopausal mind I was comparing LCTrivium to Wheelocks and others. Obviously, I was asked to compare LRTEG with LCTrivium so my response was misleading. I apologize! The reason I chose LRTEG to begin with was because of it being thoroughly Christian. I was assured I would be able to do it with my kids without help. Lots of people do. I couldn’t. I doubt that I could do LCTrivium without help either which is why the on-line class is a gift from heaven to me.

    I’m not an expert here, just a mom who’s bought and sold more Latin Curricula than any husband ought to have to bear and who is relieved to have my search ended and delighted to have sons who are finally successfully learning Latin!

    Once again, I hope this helps. Latin Road to English Grammar and Latin in the Christian Trivium are very similar to one another and both are excellent. We can be grateful for these and other wonderful options that make it possible for us to train our young people for His Glory.


  2. #12
    You have no idea what a blessing you both are to me!! I'm still kinda confused as to what to use, but LRTEG was highly recommended to me. I have 2 daughter 5th and 6th grade that I want to do this with. I really want them to get to the point of translating and reading latin. Which will accomplish this sooner? Which is more kid friendlier??
    Also, I have absolutely NO prior latin education. Which would be easier for me to teach them?

  3. #13
    I just read on website that the LCTrivium program is meant for a homeschool/co-op setting, while LRTEG is meant for a homeschool family. Also, it stated that LCTrivium was "Teacher-led" and that LRTEG was "Teacher or Self-led." Not having had any experience with either of these, I can't really tell you much, but thought this might be helpful.

    You might check this site out, as it compares all of the Latin programs you can think of.

    Good luck to you.

  4. #14

    I meant to thank you for your response. You are very generous with your time and I really appreciate it. Your information has been helpful.

    I am glad to know that the curriculums are so similar. I guess you couldn't really go wrong with either one of them.

    Thanks again,

  5. #15
    Latin Choices - This is challenging, isn't it?
    Tammy, I just went to the web-site you posted and it looks to me as though both programs come out exactly the same. My reading of the chart and both curricula’s web-site indicates both were written as a student-led for older students and teacher led for younger. I think LCTrivium would likely be better for a co-op, so that’s probably why that’s there. I think Mrs. Robinson is pretty accessible. You might just write her and ask if she prefers one more than the other.

    HomeschoolMommy, I personally think 5th grade is a bit young; I might be inclined to choose Latina Christiana (with DVDs) for your fifth grader. Another possibility would be to go slower with LREG or LCTrivium. A third option would be to wait one more year and start both of your students in the same program at the same time. In my experience, translating and reading Latin was faster with LCTrivium. For the kids, the on-going story line makes it kid friendlier and more interesting. For dad, the price of LCTrivium wins. For me, both were overwhelming but when we added the help of the on-line class, I could do LCTrivium with my sons.

    May the Lord bless you as you seek HIM to direct you.

    Joyfully, Aletha

  6. #16

    Thank you again for your response. Yes, it does look as though both programs come out the same. You and Laurie are going to think I'm nuts, but I just can't seem to let this go right now.

    I have just recently ordered LRTEG and should be receiving it any day. I am not opposed to selling it if I find that the LCTrivium fits us better (I know other ladies that will be buying LRTEG for next year so would have no problem selling it). While I was poking around some more regarding these two curriculums (which is why I am having trouble letting it go), this is what I found out. Can either of you ladies guide me here?

    First, I have read that LCTrivium has more translation exercises in their first two books than LRTEG, unlike LRTEG which suggests, in their third book, that you go back to the first two books and do those translations for more practice. I have read that because of the amount of translation exercises being offered earlier on in LCTrivium, that children were able to grasp things more quickly and, of course, more able to recognize and translate with more ease.

    Second, I have also read that LCTrivium offers more vocab words than LRTEG. Therefore, I went to each site and compared book-for-book the number of words. LCTrivium will have covered 1,056 words by the end of Vol. III (744 by the end of Vol. II), and LRTEG will have covered 900 words, more or less, by the end of Vol. III (400 by the end of Vol. II). It seems that LCTrivium may be more aggressive in this manner. Am I missing something here?

    Also, I see that LRTEG comes with flash cards, but it looks like LCTrivium does not. However, LCTrivium has drill sheets. Are these going to accomplish the same things that the flash cards would?

    And one more thing. Can you do LCTrivium as easily as LRTEG without the DVD's or on-line classes? I would prefer not to have to do that if I don't want to. And, if you do decide to do the on-line classes with LCTrivium, I understand it is only for one hour per week, correct? And, if you do the on-line classes, do you have to have the on-line teacher's correct the work, or can I still have hands on that so that I don't get lost along the way?

    No matter which curriculum I settle on, I plan to do Jensen's Vocabulary along with the Latin program. It is strictly Latin I, Latin II, and Greek vocabulary words (over 1,000 of them) and laid out so clearly. For example, Lesson I is broken down as Lesson IA, Lesson IB, Lesson IC, and Lesson ID, with the student needing to spend 20-30 minutes on Lesson IA, and only 15 minutes on each of the following lessons. You do one lesson per day and at the end of Lesson ID, you take a test. This is the format followed throughout the entire book. I just think it will enhance whatever she will be doing in Latin and won't take a lot of time.

    I know that both curriculums are excellent and I am probably putting way too much thought into this, but our dd's workload is pretty hefty and if I am going to add something like this that needs to be done every day, I really want her to enjoy it and see some real progress to keep her motivated.

    Again, thanks for any help you can provide for this "fickle" mom!


  7. #17
    Latin in the Christian Trivium/Latin Road to English Grammar - comparison continued…
    O.K., Tammy, since you know you can sell the LREG and you can return the LCTrivium, why don’t you order LCTrivium so that you can compare side-by-side for yourself? I don’t believe either program will be easily done. Learning Latin, like learning algebra, is just plain challenging! Whichever program you choose, the work will be the same. So, yes, I believe you can do LREG as easily as LCTrivium without the DVD’s or on-line classes. The difference is, should you find you need help, LCTrivium offers the on-line option. If you do decide to do the on-line classes with LCTrivium, five students meet one hour weekly in a “classroom” using a system called Gatherworks which allows them to hear the teacher and the other students as well as read on the computer. Two of my sons are in one class while a third son is in an older class that’s moving faster. I asked my sons if we could put them all in one class to consolidate our time and they told me that three computers at the same time from our home wouldn’t work. (I don’t know why! ?) That makes me think that if you have two computers you could sign up (pay) for the class as a student and participate yourself or you could sit in on the class silently from a second computer. I have a friend who does “sits in on” every class with her kids. Unlike me, my friend has a solid Latin background. She is totally capable of teaching it herself, but she finds it both helpful and enjoyable to observe someone else teach her kids. There is a genuine benefit to having the “due dates”. All of our children enjoy the class interaction.

    Another option would be to see if LCTrivium has enough moms to open a mom’s class. This would be fun and you could move ahead of your daughters; then you could be totally confident of teaching your own kiddos. It truly depends on your availability and commitment to learning Latin with your students. How important is it to you to be the person actually teaching them?

    Originally, Mrs. Harrington required the family to do all of the corrections but I think some of us weren’t doing this effectively so the on-line-teachers have ended up doing the corrections. If you are following along with your children day by day you can most certainly do your own correcting. When I am focused, I go over the work with my sons and we correct the exercises as soon as they are finished so that they can go back and restudy anything they missed. It’s nice though, when life gets chaotic, to have the teacher-on-line when, without her, this subject would come to a halt. Throughout the year, there have been weeks when I’ve worked closely with the guys and weeks when I’ve been oblivious - which isn’t the best! But the important thing to me is that in good times and crazy times, they’ve done Latin every week.

    In any case, whether you use LREG, LCTrivium as a stand-alone or LCTrivium with the help of the on-line class; you will follow the daily lesson plan.

    Really, I think you can relax about this. You can’t make a mistake because both are great programs that if your students do the work day-by-day for several years, they will have mastery of Latin. That being said, there are differences which I’ve noted in earlier posts. The only thing I prefer about LREG is the cool (expensive) ready-made notebooks which I kept and my sons are using. But really, Tammy, You need to compare for yourself because you might prefer LREG. Do order the LCTrivium today. Choose one and send the other back.

    I know how you feel. We’ve been homeschooling twenty-five years and I still agonize over every curriculum decision. That’s why I’m eager to help. In the early days we had almost no choices and no one to ask about them either. It’s a blessing to be able to help. What Tapestry of Grace has done providing this excellent forum is priceless.

    Yikes! I have to get going.
    In haste!

  8. #18

    Once again...thank you! You are so helpful, as is Laurie, regarding these two curriculums.

    I question myself, I guess, because our dd is an only child and I have three years left with her for schooling. I hope to make the best choices for her. I will talk it over with her, too. Perhaps she would like the LCTrivium because of the story format throughout. Perhaps she won't care. I will cover what each curriculum does offer.

    I am very tempted to order the LCTrivium to check it out. I will think on it a bit before I do it. I should probably at least lay eyes on the LRTEG which I have already ordered.

    Thank you for being so patient with me!!!!! Thoughts just fly in (and right back out) of my head at a very fast pace. I can't keep up with myself! I appreciate the fact that you have been trying to keep me grounded here. I'm pathetic, I know!

    Thanks again,

  9. #19
    I haven't compared the two programs, but I can give you a bit of info about LitCT. I'm currently taking a beginning online class with LitCT to catch up to my dd who has been taking Latin at co-op. (I told them I am a homeschooling mom, and they accepted me as a student.) Since I haven't completely decided whether or not I'll be using this with dd next year (6th), I only bought the student text. However, surely you could buy the teacher's edition and grade your dc's work.

    Have you had a chance to look at the samples at the LitCT website? They might be enough for your comparison.

    LitCT doesn't include flash cards because they want you to make your own. They give instructions for color-coding the cards according to the type of word (noun, etc.) I've started entering the vocabulary words into (free online flash cards), but we're not far yet (chapter 5). You could access and use my flash cards too (look in the Latin category).

    The study sheets have asked about the text/reading/background info in the chapter, and the drill sheets give more practice with translating and using the new concepts.

    If there's anything else you think I could answer about my (limited, but positive) experience with LitCT, let me know!

  10. #20

    Thank you for the information. I really like the study stack website you gave me. That is now in my "favorites" folder for future use.

    Do you find that making the flashcards is kind of a nuisance? Would you rather have them all provided for you, or does it not matter?

    I understand that LitCT offers more information than LRTEG in the study of history and have heard that that is important if your child is ever going to take the National Latin Exam (don't know if we'll do that or not yet). However, I did hear that on the National Latin Exam you could have some trouble spots because it also does cover the "pagan myths and philosophies usually associated with a Latin text book." Do I care? I don't know. I DO KNOW that I would prefer not to have to study that with my dd, but am not inclined to hide any of that from her either.

    Just some things I am thinking about.


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